Comments on: Casey Froese, hockey player: are we ready for girls in the boys’ room? http://www.femilicious.com/blog/2007/03/30/casey-froese-hockey-player-are-we-ready-for-girls-in-the-boys-room/ Thu, 20 Nov 2008 23:59:54 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.2 By: Candace http://www.femilicious.com/blog/2007/03/30/casey-froese-hockey-player-are-we-ready-for-girls-in-the-boys-room/#comment-93995 Candace Thu, 17 Apr 2008 17:06:01 +0000 http://www.femilicious.com/blog/2007/03/30/casey-froese-hockey-player-are-we-ready-for-girls-in-the-boys-room/#comment-93995 Thanks for commenting Samantha. I don't think we disagree -- I'm not arguing that boys and girls can't get changed together, ever. What I'm saying is that putting girls in the boys' change room gives the boys an unequal amount of power and puts girls at risk of harassment including sexual violence. What "at a young age" means though I'm not sure. Is 11 young? Some girls menstruate at that age. Is this "young"? If you want to argue that the team should be together doesn't that transcend age? If there was a gender-neutral change room staffed and supervised by adults representing two or more genders you might have a chance of convincing me that this could be a good thing. Another question though, has anyone wondered why they aren't all changing in the girls' room? Thanks for commenting Samantha. I don’t think we disagree — I’m not arguing that boys and girls can’t get changed together, ever. What I’m saying is that putting girls in the boys’ change room gives the boys an unequal amount of power and puts girls at risk of harassment including sexual violence. What “at a young age” means though I’m not sure. Is 11 young? Some girls menstruate at that age. Is this “young”? If you want to argue that the team should be together doesn’t that transcend age?

If there was a gender-neutral change room staffed and supervised by adults representing two or more genders you might have a chance of convincing me that this could be a good thing.

Another question though, has anyone wondered why they aren’t all changing in the girls’ room?

]]> By: Samantha Janisse http://www.femilicious.com/blog/2007/03/30/casey-froese-hockey-player-are-we-ready-for-girls-in-the-boys-room/#comment-93992 Samantha Janisse Thu, 17 Apr 2008 16:51:00 +0000 http://www.femilicious.com/blog/2007/03/30/casey-froese-hockey-player-are-we-ready-for-girls-in-the-boys-room/#comment-93992 Well i agree with this wonderful man's arguement. I think that at a young age the female gender should be able to change with the males. They are a team and should be together. I also think that once they reach a certain age they should get a differnt dressing room. But until then... Well i agree with this wonderful man’s arguement. I think that at a young age the female gender should be able to change with the males. They are a team and should be together. I also think that once they reach a certain age they should get a differnt dressing room. But until then…

]]> By: Candace http://www.femilicious.com/blog/2007/03/30/casey-froese-hockey-player-are-we-ready-for-girls-in-the-boys-room/#comment-36877 Candace Tue, 10 Apr 2007 18:43:59 +0000 http://www.femilicious.com/blog/2007/03/30/casey-froese-hockey-player-are-we-ready-for-girls-in-the-boys-room/#comment-36877 Thanks for clarifying Jan. When we're advocating social change we have to build in safety features and if our change puts people at risk then we need to consider who the change is going to benefit. From what I read and heard about this, nothing was being done or suggested to ensure safety. This is a real concern for all the reasons above and why the decision makers need to consider whether we as a community/society we are ready to take this step. I don't think we are. Thanks for clarifying Jan. When we’re advocating social change we have to build in safety features and if our change puts people at risk then we need to consider who the change is going to benefit. From what I read and heard about this, nothing was being done or suggested to ensure safety. This is a real concern for all the reasons above and why the decision makers need to consider whether we as a community/society we are ready to take this step. I don’t think we are.

]]> By: Jan Karlsbjerg http://www.femilicious.com/blog/2007/03/30/casey-froese-hockey-player-are-we-ready-for-girls-in-the-boys-room/#comment-36864 Jan Karlsbjerg Tue, 10 Apr 2007 17:17:46 +0000 http://www.femilicious.com/blog/2007/03/30/casey-froese-hockey-player-are-we-ready-for-girls-in-the-boys-room/#comment-36864 I was commenting on your argument itself, not the issues of gender, harassment, violence, etc.: If we demand absolute guarantees before any change, nothing will ever change. No four-way-stop will ever get a traffic light, because the person who proposes the change cannot guarantee that not a single person will be harmed because of the changed traffic patterns. Cheers from Vancouver, Jan Karlsbjerg I was commenting on your argument itself, not the issues of gender, harassment, violence, etc.: If we demand absolute guarantees before any change, nothing will ever change.

No four-way-stop will ever get a traffic light, because the person who proposes the change cannot guarantee that not a single person will be harmed because of the changed traffic patterns.

Cheers from Vancouver,
Jan Karlsbjerg

]]> By: Candace http://www.femilicious.com/blog/2007/03/30/casey-froese-hockey-player-are-we-ready-for-girls-in-the-boys-room/#comment-36819 Candace Tue, 10 Apr 2007 12:59:30 +0000 http://www.femilicious.com/blog/2007/03/30/casey-froese-hockey-player-are-we-ready-for-girls-in-the-boys-room/#comment-36819 I don't think it's unreasonable to ensure safe spaces for the girls on the teams. It may seem like a big task (or is it just inconvenient?) but not an impossible burden if safety was important. Would you wait until <em>after</em> a girl is harassed or worse? Girls and women are raped in their communities (and most often by people that are familiar to them) -- that's why a local change is significant. I don’t think it’s unreasonable to ensure safe spaces for the girls on the teams. It may seem like a big task (or is it just inconvenient?) but not an impossible burden if safety was important. Would you wait until after a girl is harassed or worse?

Girls and women are raped in their communities (and most often by people that are familiar to them) — that’s why a local change is significant.

]]> By: Jan Karlsbjerg http://www.femilicious.com/blog/2007/03/30/casey-froese-hockey-player-are-we-ready-for-girls-in-the-boys-room/#comment-36674 Jan Karlsbjerg Mon, 09 Apr 2007 22:43:38 +0000 http://www.femilicious.com/blog/2007/03/30/casey-froese-hockey-player-are-we-ready-for-girls-in-the-boys-room/#comment-36674 <blockquote>Can you guarantee that your daughter and every other girl will be safe at all times? You hope so but can you guarantee it?</blockquote> Why does he have to live up to that enormous burden of proof in order to change things locally? Should we demand this level of guarantees from anyone who want to change anything in our society? Cheers from Vancouver, Jan Karlsbjerg www.jankarlsbjerg.com/blog/

Can you guarantee that your daughter and every other girl will be safe at all times? You hope so but can you guarantee it?

Why does he have to live up to that enormous burden of proof in order to change things locally? Should we demand this level of guarantees from anyone who want to change anything in our society?

Cheers from Vancouver,
Jan Karlsbjerg
www.jankarlsbjerg.com/blog/

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